A Gen Z's Journey with Bitcoin - Part 2

Tali: 00:00:00

Hey everybody.

Tali: 00:00:01

Welcome to Orange Hatter.

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Today you'll be listening to part two of my conversation with Ella.

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I have two daughters and one of them used to give me her

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phone and say, please take it.

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I cannot control myself because I'll like, there will be a video that

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will catch my eye, and then two hours later I wake up from this hypnosis and

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realize that I had lost so much time.

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But it takes one video and one temptation, and she would literally throw her phone

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at me and she'd say, "Just take it."

Ella: 00:00:32

And I, you, you can, sure, the apps let you put a, like a time

Ella: 00:00:35

setting so you don't use it, but then you can just say, you know,

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remind me later, or turn off for now.

Ella: 00:00:42

And so it, it really doesn't work.

Ella: 00:00:44

But you know, most people have seen the social dilemma.

Ella: 00:00:47

Most people are more aware of this now, which I think

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is a good, it's a good thing.

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And then there's also cool Bitcoin companies that are, um, Zebedee or ZBD,

Ella: 00:00:58

you can look up both of them, but they are kind of recognizing, look, we know

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Gen Z plays games and we're going to kind of integrate Bitcoin into this and

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lightning, and we understand that this is just a part of the Gen Z culture.

Ella: 00:01:11

And so we're going to try and again, work within that, work within their

Ella: 00:01:15

interest and, and make it better.

Tali: 00:01:17

So are you on, on Zebedee?

Tali: 00:01:19

Is there a favorite game that you play that you can recommend?

Ella: 00:01:22

No, I am on, I'm not a game person, but I am excited to kind of beta test

Ella: 00:01:27

their app and so I maybe I'll, I'll come back to you with a recommendation.

Tali: 00:01:32

Yeah, for sure.

Tali: 00:01:33

Yeah.

Tali: 00:01:34

Um, so you are a junior in college right now, but you are not in the us.

Ella: 00:01:40

No, I'm not.

Tali: 00:01:41

Tell, tell us a little bit more about that.

Ella: 00:01:44

Sure.

Ella: 00:01:44

So currently I am in Paris at the moment, which I, I, as I was

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mentioning earlier, one of my favorite things to do is to wander and just

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kind of explore and walk and think.

Ella: 00:01:57

Um, I think thinking is really hard to do kind of in the culture that we have where

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we have content coming at us all the time.

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So I've been very grateful to be here, but I am doing a summer internship focused

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on energy and kind of renewable energy.

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It is, it is for a bank.

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And so, you know, that does go a little bit against Bitcoin, but I think

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a personal, um, balance I'm trying to find is kinda straddling the two

Ella: 00:02:23

worlds that we have of where I am and then, you know, Bitcoin in the future.

Ella: 00:02:27

But, um, it's been very interesting to learn more about energy and

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the renewable energy space.

Ella: 00:02:34

The bitcoin mining and energy rabbit hole is one I've started to fall down.

Ella: 00:02:39

And so, you know, I love connecting topics of what I'm interested in,

Ella: 00:02:44

whatever setting I'm in, whether that be in class and school and in work.

Ella: 00:02:48

You know, seeing the Bitcoin connections is something that I find fun.

Tali: 00:02:52

Um, so you are in Paris and summer is halfway over.

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What is the biggest difference that you have noticed between, and we're gonna go

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back to Bitcoin a little bit, so between maybe the the French view of money and

Tali: 00:03:08

how they use their money versus how we use our money here and view our money.

Ella: 00:03:15

So I'll start with the how question first.

Ella: 00:03:17

And this is something that only recently pretty much occurred to me, but in

Ella: 00:03:22

the US everyone uses a credit card.

Ella: 00:03:24

I never have cash with me in the US ever.

Ella: 00:03:27

Um, it's all credit card.

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And then when I was in China, it's all WeChat, it's all

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kind of QR code or Alipay.

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Here, it's a lot of cash.

Ella: 00:03:38

Card is, of course card is present, but it's I, I now

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actually have to have cash with me.

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And so I think that's very interesting, just from maybe the

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psychology perspective, when you think about how people are used

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to using money and then Bitcoin.

Ella: 00:03:57

So I'm, I'm reading a Progressives case for Bitcoin right now, which

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has been an incredible read.

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And the chapter I just read was all about intrinsic value and kind of

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what are the properties that you need for money and intrinsic value and the

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ability to hold money, and that money should be issued by the government

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are none of the requirements that the Fed, or not requirements, but

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anything that the Fed talks about.

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But it's all of the arguments that people originally have against Bitcoin.

Ella: 00:04:28

So I would, and this is all speculation, I really don't know how the French

Ella: 00:04:32

view Bitcoin, but if maybe they're just more used to holding the physical

Ella: 00:04:38

Euro or French Frank or I was also in Switzerland, so um, they were also very

Ella: 00:04:44

kind of cash focused as well there.

Ella: 00:04:47

Maybe they're less inclined to use Bitcoin because you can't hold it.

Ella: 00:04:53

So this is all speculation.

Ella: 00:04:54

That could be completely wrong, but I think just how people use their

Ella: 00:04:58

money, that's very interesting.

Ella: 00:05:00

And then the perception of.

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Bitcoin.

Ella: 00:05:03

I don't know from a French perspective.

Ella: 00:05:07

Um, however, I started the summer in Prague at the Bitcoin conference

Ella: 00:05:12

there, which was incredible, highly recommended or watching the, the sessions.

Ella: 00:05:16

And I think Europe just generally is way more ahead of the US in terms of Bitcoin.

Ella: 00:05:23

I think the first Bitcoin ETF was started in Paris.

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So I guess that's a French perspective.

Ella: 00:05:29

But just in terms of regulations and just acceptance of crypto or Bitcoin,

Ella: 00:05:35

I think is more ahead generally on the whole in Europe than it is in the US.

Tali: 00:05:40

I read, um, a book called The Psychology of Money, and there's

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definitely a different perspective from this, the mindset of the spender

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when you hold physical cash and you are having to hand it to somebody, count

Tali: 00:05:55

it out and hand it to somebody else, versus the swipe of a card and everything

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is just kind of abstract and unreal.

Ella: 00:06:03

Yeah, actually that's such a good point.

Ella: 00:06:04

So maybe, maybe the French are more inclined to adopt Bitcoin because they,

Ella: 00:06:08

they understand the value of money more.

Ella: 00:06:11

But yes, that was, that's a great book as well.

Tali: 00:06:13

Yeah, that was really cool.

Tali: 00:06:14

So tell me more about Prague.

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You were there and you were a speaker and I don't know how much you were

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able to kind of mingle off the stage.

Tali: 00:06:24

What was your, the best thing that you learned from there that surprised you?

Ella: 00:06:29

Yes.

Ella: 00:06:30

So unfortunately my mingling was not as, um, much as I had hoped.

Ella: 00:06:35

There were just some delays getting to Prague physically.

Ella: 00:06:39

But I think any time you can be surrounded by Bitcoiners is just amazing.

Ella: 00:06:44

I think you nev you always, after being with Bitcoiners, you

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leave feeling more energized.

Ella: 00:06:49

Um, And just, you know, let's, let's go, let's get on the mission.

Ella: 00:06:52

So it was great.

Ella: 00:06:53

Something that was really cool that I just had never considered that I

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learned while I was there came from the European Bitcoiners' group and something

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that they're working on is translating Bitcoin, um, knowledge and information.

Ella: 00:07:09

And I, I've completely taken for granted all of the Bitcoin

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knowledge and information that I have because I speak English and a

Ella: 00:07:17

lot of it's coming from the U.S..

Ella: 00:07:19

So that was something that I, I really didn't think about.

Ella: 00:07:22

But I loved learning about what they're doing.

Ella: 00:07:24

So, so it was really great.

Ella: 00:07:26

But, um, to go back to the start of your question, yes, I was there for Generation

Ella: 00:07:30

Bitcoin, which is a group of Gen Z Bitcoiners who are really on a mission

Ella: 00:07:36

to try and bring Bitcoin education to Gen Z and really inspire them to be a

Ella: 00:07:42

part of the Bitcoin space and, um, grow it and innovate in it because they will

Ella: 00:07:48

inherit Bitcoin, um, moving forward.

Tali: 00:07:51

So let's talk more about the GenZ project.

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So you are one of the four leaders in the group.

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What is your role and what is the approach that you guys have for

Tali: 00:08:05

carrying out the mission that you have?

Ella: 00:08:07

Yes, absolutely.

Ella: 00:08:09

So the three co-founders are Arsh Molu, Ishaana Misra, and Autumn Domingo.

Ella: 00:08:14

And then I am very lucky to now be a part of the group, um, but I'm the fourth.

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And so I am in charge of projects.

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And so one project that we are just starting is called

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the Bitcoin University Guide.

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And so I'll preface by saying the whole reason for the founding of this group

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is to really emphasize the fact that Gen Z is kind of Bitcoin's future.

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That it's important for students to feel encouraged to embrace Bitcoin,

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where their world is changing a lot, but Bitcoin is kind of hope

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and that Bitcoin is for everyone.

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So this is really where the Bitcoin University Guide comes in.

Ella: 00:08:53

A lot of students when they're applying to college or when they're first in

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college, even though they, they say that you can kind of go in undeclared

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or you don't need to know what you're gonna do or you don't know, you don't

Ella: 00:09:05

need to know what you're going to study.

Ella: 00:09:07

In order to get into college, you have to write a lot of essays and

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you have to be persuasive about some topic that you're interested in.

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And so I think we're funneled into, you know, you do need to figure

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out what you wanna study and what you wanna do kind of early on.

Ella: 00:09:24

And so Bitcoin, I'd say is mostly not marketed, but marketed for

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math or computer science students.

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And so if you're not studying math or you're not studying for computer

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science, maybe you're less inclined to give any of your time to Bitcoin.

Ella: 00:09:41

'Cause everyone's, everyone's busy.

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No one has lots of time to listen to a two hour podcast or even know which two Hour

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podcast is the best for them to listen to.

Ella: 00:09:51

So this guide is for those students.

Ella: 00:09:54

So let's say you are a philosophy major and you're learning about

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different philosophers and what they define property as.

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And so then we then talk about those same philosophers and those ideas,

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but in the context of Bitcoin.

Ella: 00:10:10

So this guide is, it's not super in depth.

Ella: 00:10:13

It's just supposed to be enough that it gives you a taste and hopefully

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sparks your interest in Bitcoin.

Ella: 00:10:18

So that's one way.

Ella: 00:10:20

And then we're also going to, we're really trying to build out the foundation

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right now and kind of revamp it, but we'll hold Twitter spaces as well.

Ella: 00:10:28

We're working with another group called the Bitcoin Student Clubs Network, which

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is all about how do we support each other and bringing Bitcoin to campuses.

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And we also are almost about to be an official nonprofit.

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So I think all the papers are filed.

Ella: 00:10:43

We're just waiting on the final, um, the final confirmations.

Ella: 00:10:46

So hopefully we're just trying to reach students wherever they are and,

Ella: 00:10:50

you know, bring them into the space.

Tali: 00:10:53

Thank you for listening.

Tali: 00:10:54

Did you hear anything in our conversation today that you resonated with?

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Were you able to identify with some of the feelings that Ella had?

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If so, I would love to hear from you.

Tali: 00:11:06

Please send your questions or comments to my email Tali@orangehatter.com.

Tali: 00:11:14

I would love to hear from you.

Tali: 00:11:16

Come back tomorrow and hear the rest of our conversation.

Tali: 00:11:19

Thank you.

Tali: 00:11:19

See you soon.